Pastor Dave Commments--
Note 1-
Nowen became an academic star quickly-- teaching at Notre Dame, Yale, and then Harvard. His books quickly became best sellers and he was a sought after speaker. But, he was restless beyond belief never feeling authenic, never feeling at home. This gifted leader, a man who was gifted in using words (spoken and written) didn't find the best version of himself until he was asked to minister in a community of severely handicapped people-- L'Arche in Toronto, Canada. Many who lived there could not understand his words or his writings. Henri had to learn to communicate in new ways- by actions of love and compassion and tangible care. It was there (at L'Arche) that some of his most profound writings emerged as one sensed that something profound was happening in his life- ironically after he left the spotlight of high profile and prestigious universities. Many thought he was crazy but Nouwen was continually exposed to people like Trevor (pages 22 and 23), who "lived out the best version of himself"
How would you have reacted to someone like Trevor coming in and offering that toast? Would you have joined in the singing of "If you're happy and you know it, raise your glass? Would it inspire you or would you just be playing along?
2) page 25 quotes-
"Comparison kills spiritual growth". . ..
"Spiritual greatness has nothing to do with being greater than others. It has everything to do with being as great as each of us can be. "
"Each of us has a me that we think we should be, which is at odds with the me that God made us to be."
I would invite you to comment on these quotes as I think your comments will benefit the group.
3. FTT- Failure to thrive. This was an interesting concept. "Psychologists have begun to speak of what is perhaps the largest mental health problem today. It is not depression or anxiety, at least not at clinical levels. It is languishing-- a failure to thrive. . . . .It is weariness of soul and inability to delight in life".
That being said, do you agree with Orberg's notion that for each of us, "there is a person inside of you waiting to come alive."?
If you are (or someone you know) is in that FTT state- what kind of help do you need/ or can give?
Can you think of stories/ movies where someone is languishing and been helped by a catalyst (helped to thrive)? What "take home' lessons can you glean from that story?
4. Here is where it boils down for me-- "God designed you to flourish 'so that' you could be part of his redemptive project in ways that you otherwise could not."
What that says to me is that when we become the best verison of ourselves-- God can really use us in helping the world around us. therefore, much is at stake!
5. Open ended-- please share any insights/ comments/ quotes that you feel would benefit the group from chapter 2.
1. I would like to believe that I would have joined and been inspired and moved by the experience. And it is one of my favorite songs!
ReplyDelete2. Comparison kills growth of any type I think. What great things we could all do if we didn't compare ourselves to others. Just like the analogy he uses for the kids thinking they are artists...as soon as we are old enough to see the differences, we are comparing them. As far as the last one, I don't have a clue what I think God wants me to be. Maybe that's part of the search here for me.
3. More like come back to life. Again I think the zest that we have as kids to just live and be the best we can be gets lost before we even realize it has happened. Then we spend all our time trying to get it back. I just recently viewed the movie Crazy Heart with Jeff Bridges. He is exactly a man with a failure to thrive and it takes a big wake up call to snap him out of it. It's unfortunate, but I think it takes something big like that to really wake a person up.
4. This is a tough one because it involves believing that we can make a difference. Some days that's a hard sell.
5. There was really one paragraph that hit me the most in this chapter on page 24.
"Inside us is a person without pretense or guile. We never have to pretend with God, and genuine brokenness pleases God more than pretend spirituality. If I am ever going to become the me I want to be, I have to start being honest about the me I am."
I believe that and I believe that's what I'm trying to figure out for myself.
1. I'm not sure how I would react. I would probably be uncomfortable at first. That's how I tend to react when behavior doesn't suit the situation as I see it. I would probably sing along, though, and eventually appreciate what was happening.
ReplyDelete2. Comparison isn't necessarily bad--it depends on what we use it for. In the context of that section and how it was used, it does affect growth. However, comparison also allows us to recognize and celebrate our differences. I guess it's a tool that can be used in positive and negative ways. The problem is our tendency to use it negatively most of the time.
3. I like Monicarose's comment about coming back to life. Modern existence can be a real grind, and when it gets that way we lose perspective. That's what was happening at the beginning of the first chapter when Ortberg's wife pulled him aside. I think we do have an innocent, excitable, curious, fun, loving person inside that we suppress because we think it will interfere with the important things we need to do.
Helping someone who's experiencing spiritual death can't be easy. How did they get there? Difficult experiences, weighty cares, deep-seated attitudes. They may not even be aware of the situation they're in, so they're not looking for help. I don't think there's a magic pill. Clearly, telling someone like that what they should be doing would be trying to make them the "me I want them to be" rather than the "me God wants them to be." Listening, caring, encouraging, being a friend?
4-5. I agree that there are lots of "Me's." I know that I have several myself, and enough family, friends, and colleagues to add several more. I don't know that any of these are close to what God designed me to be, but I strongly doubt it. That's why I'm here.
1-After initially feeling uncomfortable, I would probably start singing with "Trevor" and encourage him so he might be respected by those surrounding him. Recently I have had the opportunity to interact with some high school boys with autism. It is so inportant to recognize them as high school boys first, before focusing on their illness which separates them from the rest of the crowd. Just giving them recognition by name, and acceptance is vital, as is with any "trevor" that crosses our path, however uncomfortable we may be at first.
ReplyDelete2-Comparison...we ALL do it...and in some cases it causes good things to happen by reaching higher and finding out more of our potential, but unfortunately often the other side occurs, and we feel unfulfilled because we fall short of others. The me inside is seeking to come out, but has been struggling with all the rest of the stuff I have to do, so God seems to have been made to wait...again...wo sorry, God. If only I could let that me out.....
3.Failure to thrive...yes, I do believe there have been times of this in my life---comes and goes, when good friends or mentors have been more or less active in my growth/struggles. I believe we all need mentors/solid friendships even beyond our spouse who can meet us where we are at currently, and take us on through whatever good OR bad might be happening, and with that, our ability to thrive will more easily be met.
4. Yes, much is at stake if we are not flourishing, or given the chance to flourish--we CAN make such a difference is we are ourselves nourished and nurtured to flourish....does this make sense??
1. I would have been uncomfortable at first, but I think I would have joined in (partly to ease tension, and partly to affirm Trevor and what he was doing – recognizing that his toast came from the heart).
ReplyDelete2. When comparisons are made to judge value – yes, they kill spiritual growth. When I use comparisons to judge my value against others (am I as good as or better than X) then I ‘lose’ (and so does the other) no matter where my comparison comes out.
Spiritual greatness isn’t about who has more of God’s spirit – but boy the temptation to play that game is pretty great. It isn’t something we grab hold of – it is God grabbing ahold of us and therefore is more about how open are we to having God grab ahold.
The me I think I should be vs the me God made me to be – goes back to chapter one about flourishing when we don’t focus on ourselves. If I’m constantly worried about what I should be – then I’m certainly not being the me God intended because I certainly won’t be flourishing, which is the me God made me to be. Does that make sense?
3. FTT has a very specific medical meaning and in children implies a poor rate of physical growth. Obviously the context in this chapter has to do with spiritual languishing (lack of spiritual growth/nourishment). I think it is real, but I also think the tendency is to think we can fix it ourselves by just doing ‘stuff.’
5. “Sometimes the me I pretend to be leaks out in small acts of vanity.” (location 356-82)
“God’s plan is not for you to obey him because you should even though you don’t want to. He made you to want his plan for you.” (location 400-407)
“There is an enormous difference between following rules and following Jesus, because I can follow rules without cultivating the right heart.” (location 435-40)
I struggle a lot with the shoulds – part of my ‘heritage’ as a Luther I guess is feeling a lot of guilt about my relationship with God (it’s never what I think it should be). And I leak out my sinfulness in pretending to be a better person/Christian than I think I really am. I delude myself by thinking that I am following Jesus because I am following the rules (silly me – in my heart I know that isn’t right, but it’s the part of me pretending to be the me I think others expect).
1: I might have wondered at Trevor's singing at first, but when you are in the presence of someone who loves in the moment and has pure joy - it sure is contagious. I think being able to live in the moment is one of the greatest gifts. I always enjoy young children so much and the fact that they truly know how to live in the moment. It’s something we seem to forget as we get older.
ReplyDelete2."Comparison kills spiritual growth". I think having role models or seeing someone else live in such a way that makes you want to be better can be a good thing. But we need to open ourselves to God and what God wants for us. None of us are the same, and that is OK. And that is good. I think God wants our diversity.
"Each of us has a me that we think we should be, which is at odds with the me that God made us to be." Whenever we have to go around the room and introduce ourselves, I spend the whole time thinking about what I should say instead of focusing on what others are saying. And then I realize I missed the whole point, which was to listen to others in the first place... So I think that if I could sit back and listen to God a little more, then maybe I would not be at odds with who God would want me to be.
3. I know a young man who seems kind of lost. He doesn’t seem to know which direction to go in. He seems afraid to tackle new things. I so wish I could say something meaningful to him. He is in my prayers – I wish so much that he could find a passion in life and a job that matches his passion. I so hope he can thrive in this life and not be so afraid.
“Don’t push the river” I think as a parent I always want to be in control and make this world a safe place for my children. But, I recognize that you can’t be in control. We need to flow with the river and trust God will take care of us. We can’t make other people be happy. We can’t control who they are or who we think they should be. We need to let go and be a part of the river. We need to let go and let ourselves be who we should be.
1. I would probably have been the first to join in, and in harmony. Of course, it really helps you have the confidence to do that if people don't usually ask you to please be quiet. ;-)
ReplyDeleteThe planet is mostly bereft of appreciation and affirmation. It is amazing how little needs to be sincerely expressed on a regular basis before profound positive effects in peoples' self-images begin to improve their outlooks. It is also amazing how few lives need to show the benefits of this ministry before you yourself become hooked on helping as many people as you can--it just feels so good.